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Barry Shein
24 November 2019 ·
(clears throat) Can I say something?
TBH I've never really understood what ISOC does.
I've been asked for some substantial donations from them, I've been suggested as a board member (no relation, years apart), even interviewed but I think I said that I don't know what they do which probably didn't go over well. I did have lunch with Andrew Sullivan shortly after he became president & CEO of ISOC but I don't remember talking about ISOC except maybe congratulating him, minor chit-chat like that.
I know they hold some important contracts and organizational MoUs, I suppose .ORG used to be one of them. To my knowledge there has never been an ISOC group in Boston which is pretty amazing if you think about it, I suppose, I don't know really.
A couple of years ago I was invited to an attempt to found one here and went. Only about two other people showed up other than the organizer, who I knew. I think the other two were hoping there'd be free drinks (it was at a bar) 🙂
Never heard anything about that again.
I joined the ISOC-NYC group for some specific reason, I forget why, so have received some email typically about some talk in NYC. But that doesn't require much organization.
But I suppose it's nice that they will now have much more money to do whatever it is they do, just don't ask me what that is.

Richard Sexton TCP fan club. They organize trade shows for internet protocols.
Barry Shein Author Aren't you thinking of InterOp? I've never heard of any ISOC trade show and it doesn't seem possible that I wouldn't be on their mailing list for something like that.

Richard Sexton No. They are to the net what cheerleaders are to football teams. They do this with thinly disguised trade shows. 1
Dmitry Kohmanyuk Richard Sexton there used to be ION conferences but I think they are gone. You know more about them?
Christopher Ambler Well, one thing they did do was try to take over before ICANN came along. Remember the IAHC? Core? Seven new TLDs that ISOC would own? So... power grabs?
Barry Shein Author I was really hoping someone would mention something I'd missed which happened this century.
Christopher Ambler Barry Shein Hey, we are still dealing with events from the Crusades. 2
Ole Jacobsen badge icon Christopher Ambler Only you, and not well apparently.
Christopher Ambler Oh, I find it terribly amusing. Most people came in well after that period and have no idea. Thankfully it was a spectacular failure. I handled that part pretty well, apparently.
Simon Higgs Look, if everyone just kept up on their incoming UUCP feed, they’d know what was going on. 6
Barry Shein Author There is 2
Dmitry Burkov Barry Shein it was in previous century... 1
John Ioannidis IHOP?

Richard Sexton Yes but IHOP actually produces something. ISOC just takes.
Franck Martin They are the umbrella organisation for IETF, as IETF does not exist, or at least did not exist till a few years ago. First IETF organization created was the IETF trust. 1
Barry Shein Author Which means they are not the umbrella organization for the IETF?
Franck Martin Barry Shein ISOC still signs most of the legal contracts for “IETF” and used to own all the IP and copyrights in RFCs until the trust was setup.
Barry Shein Author Ok, thanks, your time lines are a little confusing to me but I think I can work it out.
Glenn Deen Franck Martin No longer. The IETF Administration LLC now signs IETF contracts as of Aug 2018
Franck Martin Glenn Deen , about time. I guess IETF now has funding sources which are not ISOC. anymore?
Glenn Deen Franck Martin they’ve long had diverse funding - sponsors and meeting fees from attendees, and ISOC still contributes as well and from the statement by Andrew they remain committed to the IETF. The IETF LLC enables the IETF to directly manage its own operations.

Richard Sexton Recall is was the holy triumvirate of ISOC (Don Heath), ITU (Bob Shaw) and WIPO (Albert Tramposch) that met at an Ottawa OECD meeting that started the whole IAHC/ICANN mess. 2
Dmitry Kohmanyuk They are “the social” pillar of ICANN and apparently also fund the technical, IETF. Ok? (The other three would be USGovt, ITU, and as RS recalled, WIPO.)
Ole Jacobsen badge icon Thanks for explaining what ALAC does 2
Dmitry Kohmanyuk Ole Jacobsen (points to recent ALAC photo.) Look, ALAC is ICANNs own attempt to displace the concept of ISOC chapters. I have submitted personal application to EURALO. You know how many *individual* members in Europe there are? (Hint: not a hundred.) 1
Ole Jacobsen badge icon Dmitry Kohmanyuk OK, but up until recently ALAC pointed to organizations such as ISOC *chapters* as the final "leafs" on the tree, somehow representing end users of the Internet. ISOC chapter members are quite sophisticated Internet users IMO. ISOC mem… See more 1
Barry Shein Author A bit like SMERSH.
Dmitry Kohmanyuk Ole Jacobsen I am also a (formerly paid) member and I also convinced Ukrainian TLD operator to join ISOC as corporate member. I was not able to convince our new CEO that ISOC membership add value, so we had since stopped paying annual bills.
Eberhard Lisse Ole Jacobsen, Do not use the words ALAC and do (or does) in the same sentence! 1
Joly MacFie The 2020 Action Plan was just released
Action Plan: 2020 | Internet Society
Barry Shein Author Some items on that do seem substantive and involve funding specific projects in support of internet infrastructure. Thanks. 2
Mike Godwin Barry Shein, as a nominated candidate and later a recently appointed ISOC trustee, I learned about ISOC's current programs from its website (the one Joly cites, supra) and decided they were substantive enough to accept the nomination and later the election/appointment to the board of trustees. It's an unpaid appointment, but I have thought it was worth my volunteer effort, even though I sometimes have to get on a jet and travel around the world. (Still recovering from back-to-back meetings in Singapore and Deutschland. When I say "back-to-back" I of course mean they have returned my partially healing back to its painful long-distance-flight-injured state.)
Barry Shein Author Perhaps what ISOC should be doing with part of its new found cash position is investigate and suggest improvements in long-distance air travel as that's what really seems to keep anything resembling internet governance operating.
Mike Godwin Its "new cash position"? Not exactly how I'd characterize it. The sale essentially puts ISOC in the same revenue position it was in already, only with the equivalent of an endowment rather than reliance on raking all profits out of PIR.
Franck Martin ISOC has no clue what to do with its chapters. Chapters are just loosely associated with the goals of ISOC. More often than not ISOC HQ works against its chapters. 1
Ole Jacobsen badge icon Franck Martin Well, speaking as a former VP for ISOC Chapters, that problem works both ways; chapters working against HQ. 2
David Lawrence In what ways do these anti-workings take form? 1
Ole Jacobsen badge icon David Lawrence Usually in the form of chapters making public statements that are not in line with official ISOC policy. Then there was the Catalonia matter which others can explain better than me. 1
Franck Martin and ISOC supporting initiatives in the chapter area without the courtesy of letting them know. This is also what is described, ISOC has no clue what its chapters do because there is little communication and because there is a very top-down approach.
Mike Godwin In that sense, it's like many other national and international NGOs that have allowed organizational efforts to form chapters without first establishing what it is the chapters would need to be doing. I've been lucky enough to work for or with several,… See more
Wallace Bird I am missing the ICANN Bad Attitude. An ISOC Bad Attitude clearly is needed. Perhaps it could form as a Chapter? 7
Joly MacFie A BAG? 3
Dmitry Burkov ISOC was an attempt of ICANN pre-release... 3
Kevin Murphy badge icon Does anyone know what ISOC does? 2

Richard Sexton Even ISOC doesn't know that.

Richard Sexton Who started ISOC? Start there.
Cecilia M. Preston Richard Sexton I remember Vint asking me where he might find a coon skin cap for some announcement about ISOC. I told him we were at Tivoli Gardens, Copenhagen and they probably did not have any. 1

Richard Sexton Rutkowski started it. Then they kicked him out.He was general counsel for the ITU at the time. This is well documented.Or you can jsut ask him. Vint worked on the last 3/4 of TCP. Bob Kahn wrote the rest. Vint didn't do anywhere near as many things as you'd think, he's just really good at self promotion.
Christian Huitema Uh? ISOC was started during an IAB meeting in 1992. Tony was nowhere near it.
Raoul Plommer Yeah, let's see these well documented documents.
Ole Jacobsen badge icon Christian Huitema I believe it was started in 1991 in Copenhagen during the Landweber meeting. The first INET conference was organized by ISOC in Kobe in 1992. 1
Christian Huitema Ole Jacobsen you are right about 1991, and I was confusing 1991 and 1992. The IAB meeting that I had in mind occured in San Diego in 1991. I have a vivid recollection of Jon signing as first member of ISOC. It is actually minuted here:
IAB Minutes 1991-06-14 | Internet Architecture Board
Eberhard Lisse My view has been since the first encounter with them that while the going had been good, their time had passed.
Joly MacFie OK Boomer! 2
John Ioannidis Isoc, usoc, we all sock
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